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ASDA's Planning application for a petrol station


Chris Chappell
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I am now at the point where as ward councillor, need to seek views of others on this item. I will be meeting with ASDA representatives shortly and they have been in discussions with planners and Highways England.

 

I understand there will be public consultation at ASDA by their representatives in the lead up to Christmas.

I understand that ASDA's consultants believe that there will be an increase in traffic movements on this junction of 40% at peak times. 48 vehicles an hour extra.

 

Would like to hear the views, not just of local people, but from anyone who regularly crosses the river either way and uses Ross Road or Belmont Road. I will not have a public view until I have consulted more widely, heard from ASDAs consultants, heard back from their in store consultations and talked to other interested people.

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Chris, this has been discussed several times, the last time was in this thread here. Personally I have no objection as I do not believe there will be that much extra traffic simply because Asda have a garage. The traffic using a garage will either be existing Asda customers or traffic passing, so I do not think there will be any additional traffic created on this junction because there happens to be a new garage on site.

 

Bottom line is this application should not be refused because of this council's lack in dealing with this city's traffic issues, that would be unfair. The council need to sort out this traffic problem properly, it has been going on for years! They need to turn this junction back into a proper roundabout and get rid of the pathetic traffic light system that obviously is a hindrance rather than an aid.

 

I think there were only a couple of objections previously but this land was originally going to be used for housing/flats anyway.

 

Read through all the various comments in the previous debate.

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Both Cllr Bob Preece and Cllr Chris Chappell have been opposed to this garage application since it was first submitted back in February 2012. I stick to my original comments which you will find here.

 

 

I could not agree more. The issue is the traffic and the councils failure to deal with it, this should have nothing to do with Asda's planning application.

 

 

I agree with what K.Butt wrote back then because both Cllr's clearly think there will be additional traffic which is not going to happen in reality. 

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Chris, this has been discussed several times, the last time was in this thread here. Personally I have no objection as I do not believe there will be that much extra traffic simply because Asda have a garage. The traffic using a garage will either be existing Asda customers or traffic passing, so I do not think there will be any additional traffic created on this junction because there happens to be a new garage on site.

 

Bottom line is this application should not be refused because of this council's lack in dealing with this city's traffic issues, that would be unfair. The council need to sort out this traffic problem properly, it has been going on for years! They need to turn this junction back into a proper roundabout and get rid of the pathetic traffic light system that obviously is a hindrance rather than an aid.

 

I think there were only a couple of objections previously but this land was originally going to be used for housing/flats anyway.

 

Read through all the various comments in the previous debate.

 

I would love to know where they get these figures from? I am with the other members on this one, I do not buy into the view that having a garage will increase traffic movement by 40% at peak times. Anyone wanting to use a garage here is more than likely going to be already on this stretch of road anyway, so having a garage will have very little effect in my opinion.

 

There is no objections to the proposed flats that will be built where the Ship Inn is and I see no difference here.

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I would love to know where they get these figures from? I am with the other members on this one, I do not buy into the view that having a garage will increase traffic movement by 40% at peak times. Anyone wanting to use a garage here is more than likely going to be already on this stretch of road anyway, so having a garage will have very little effect in my opinion.

 

There is no objections to the proposed flats that will be built where the Ship Inn is and I see no difference here.

The figures that these people come up with are mind boggling. This application being discussed is for a garage nothing to do with any housing or flats as far as I am concerned. To answer the original question put to us by Councillor Chappell, I travel along the Belmont Road and across the river everyday to get to work and if Asda build a garage I really cannot see that making much of an impact of the traffic, I tend to agree on the side of what has already been written here by other members. A garage will make very little or no difference at all to the traffic congestion, it cannot get any worse! I do so see motorists flocking to this particular part of Hereford just because a garage has been built. The majority of motorists would be existing customers of Asda or passing traffic only.

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There's no link on this thread to any 'planning application' but am I right in assuming the potential garage will be on that lump of grass near the Asda shop exit? 

 

Users' of this garage, on leaving, will want to go either left into town or right down either Ross Road or Belmont Road so the redundant slip road exit there already would probably be unsuitable as it would force everyone back north over the bridge and so the garage exit would probably use the existing shop exit. There would be extra vehicles using that exit who have only used the garage so there would be a potential to cause traffic 'back up' into Asda property. That's their problem. And for shoppers' leaving who have used the shop.

 

The only knock on effect for the thru road, as I see it, is southbound traffic, coming over the bridge, might want to use the garage who wouldn't have wanted to use the shop. The Asda lights that cut thru the roundabout only let about 7 cars thru so you might get a back up, over the bridge (in lane 2), caused by extra garage traffic.

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First things first Chris, (and the rest of the cllrs) GET THEM BLOODY LIGHTS TURNED OFF.

It has been proven several times that traffic flows effortlessly when the lights are out of action for one reason or another. COMMON SENSE PREVAILS MOST.

I bet 98% of people would agree too.

As for the Filling Station, I agree with majority. I can't see folk travelling across town just to use it.

I ask you this, tesco is 1 mile up the road, Locks is a further 3 miles but with better quality fuel at the same price; do you keep going or stop and shop too? Then the other way, baynhams another mile and another 1 for commercial rd. In all honesty how many folk generally go out of their way to fill up? They don't! They incorporate it into their travel plans.

Let's use common sense please. I know it's hard to find but surly you and your compadres can muster some between you?

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In all honesty how many folk generally go out of their way to fill up? They don't! They incorporate it into their travel plans.

Let's use common sense please.

 

Disagree. My wife has to drive past Tesco at Belmont to get home and her brain is so tired after working all day she hands me the keys and asks me to fill up the car. I generally then try to collect Clubcard points. Just the situation in my house. Not ideal. 

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First things first Chris, (and the rest of the cllrs) GET THEM BLOODY LIGHTS TURNED OFF.

It has been proven several times that traffic flows effortlessly when the lights are out of action for one reason or another. COMMON SENSE PREVAILS MOST.

I bet 98% of people would agree too.

As for the Filling Station, I agree with majority. I can't see folk travelling across town just to use it.

I ask you this, tesco is 1 mile up the road, Locks is a further 3 miles but with better quality fuel at the same price; do you keep going or stop and shop too? Then the other way, baynhams another mile and another 1 for commercial rd. In all honesty how many folk generally go out of their way to fill up? They don't! They incorporate it into their travel plans.

Let's use common sense please. I know it's hard to find but surly you and your compadres can muster some between you?

 

Common sense indeed.  :Thumbs-Up:

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DILLIGAF, no point in being rude, just trying to get a view point from some of you. The planners and councillors can only make a decision on what is there now not what you or others may want to see.

 

We have the present road junction/ traffic lights situation. So we have to look at the application with that in mind. When I meet with ASDA, I will ask if they are prepared to persuade Highways England, to alter road junction and traffic lights.

 

I will also ask them how they reached the vehicle movement figures they have presented to the planners. I will let them know you think they are incorrect.

 

Thank you all for your factual comments.

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DILLIGAF, no point in being rude, just trying to get a view point from some of you. The planners and councillors can only make a decision on what is there now not what you or others may want to see.

 

We have the present road junction/ traffic lights situation. So we have to look at the application with that in mind. When I meet with ASDA, I will ask if they are prepared to persuade Highways England, to alter road junction and traffic lights.

 

I will also ask them how they reached the vehicle movement figures they have presented to the planners. I will let them know you think they are incorrect.

 

Thank you all for your factual comments.

 

Just to clarify my comments of these figures, I actually mean that the movements of traffic would be a lot less than 48% NOT MORE. 

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Just to clarify my comments of these figures, I actually mean that the movements of traffic would be a lot less than 48% NOT MORE. 

 

I share the same view, who came up with additional movement figures being as high as 48%? personally, I hardly think there will be any additional traffic at all.

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Both Cllr Bob Preece and Cllr Chris Chappell have been opposed to this garage application since it was first submitted back in February 2012. I stick to my original comments which you will find here.

 

 

 

 

I agree with what K.Butt wrote back then because both Cllr's clearly think there will be additional traffic which is not going to happen in reality. 

 

 

Thank you Bill.

 

The issue that the council always refer too in this location is that of the traffic and the councils failure to deal with it, this should have nothing to do with Asda's planning application,  just pass this application it will make NO DIFFERENCE TO THE TRAFFIC!

 

They could do with opening the little slip road, create a 'give way' at the end of if allowing people to filter left over the bridge. No need for lights there. 

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The council does not have a view at present on the application, hence the reason for consulting with the public. There are in fact very few statutory groups that have to be consulted. The city council and public, outside the immediate area, are not among them.

 

The future of the junction, as has been said many times, is the responsibility of Highways England. They do have to be consulted about the ASDA application. They are the reason this application has taken so long to decide. Even if Highways England say tomorrow that they will do away with all the traffic lights at this junction, and will make alterations next year, it still does not alter what there is there now and therefore this application!

 

Residents of St. Martins Street have expressed fears that it will take even longer than now to exit on to the A49 at peak times if the garage is built. They expressed concerns that it will take longer than now to cross this junction if ASDA's figures are correct! Some people have expressed to me that it will take longer than now to exit ASDA at peak times.

 

K.Butt.

Perhaps we could meet sometime, you name time and day, at peak times, to look at your suggestion about the slip road?

My concerns are based around its closeness to the pelican crossing! When the traffic lights have be done away with, I wonder if traffic exiting here from the petrol station, will make it more safe for the pelican crossing than now? perhaps we should meet at 5pm sometime to observe!

 

I would be grateful if there are any surveys been done by bloggers that show traffic movements will not be affected, if they can be sent to the planning office, so that planners have opportunities to review all options.

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Chris, there are too many pelican crossing around these lights imo. There is one up by the roundabout stores (Belmont Ave) then another stupid/dangerous set actually ON the traffic lights, which has caught many motorists out coming from town, the main lights change to green and then you have to stop immediately again and inside the yellow box because someone has crossed the road and lights changed again. Then there is the set you refer too but what is wrong with getting rid of those altogether? They are not really needed because pedestrians have Drybridge Walk. If they cleaned that up and added more lighting it would encourage people to use it.

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Chris, there are too many pelican crossing around these lights imo. There is one up by the roundabout stores (Belmont Ave) then another stupid/dangerous set actually ON the traffic lights, which has caught many motorists out coming from town, the main lights change to green and then you have to stop immediately again and inside the yellow box because someone has crossed the road and lights changed again. Then there is the set you refer too but what is wrong with getting rid of those altogether? They are not really needed because pedestrians have Drybridge Walk. If they cleaned that up and added more lighting it would encourage people to use it.

 

Drybridge Walk brings people out in St Martins Street, I have always felt that this pedestrian lights are quite dangerous they are not in the best place.

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Chris, there are too many pelican crossing around these lights imo. There is one up by the roundabout stores (Belmont Ave) then another stupid/dangerous set actually ON the traffic lights, which has caught many motorists out coming from town, the main lights change to green and then you have to stop immediately again and inside the yellow box because someone has crossed the road and lights changed again. Then there is the set you refer too but what is wrong with getting rid of those altogether? They are not really needed because pedestrians have Drybridge Walk. If they cleaned that up and added more lighting it would encourage people to use it.

 

I agree Mick. 

 

Drybridge Walk is under used but I think if they cleaned it up, added additional lighting and possibly CCTV it would help.

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The council does not have a view at present on the application, hence the reason for consulting with the public. There are in fact very few statutory groups that have to be consulted. The city council and public, outside the immediate area, are not among them.

 

The future of the junction, as has been said many times, is the responsibility of Highways England. They do have to be consulted about the ASDA application. They are the reason this application has taken so long to decide. Even if Highways England say tomorrow that they will do away with all the traffic lights at this junction, and will make alterations next year, it still does not alter what there is there now and therefore this application!

 

Residents of St. Martins Street have expressed fears that it will take even longer than now to exit on to the A49 at peak times if the garage is built. They expressed concerns that it will take longer than now to cross this junction if ASDA's figures are correct! Some people have expressed to me that it will take longer than now to exit ASDA at peak times.

 

K.Butt.

Perhaps we could meet sometime, you name time and day, at peak times, to look at your suggestion about the slip road?

My concerns are based around its closeness to the pelican crossing! When the traffic lights have be done away with, I wonder if traffic exiting here from the petrol station, will make it more safe for the pelican crossing than now? perhaps we should meet at 5pm sometime to observe!

 

I would be grateful if there are any surveys been done by bloggers that show traffic movements will not be affected, if they can be sent to the planning office, so that planners have opportunities to review all options.

This is Herefords problem,,always will that Highways England have to be consulted on every road restructuring.Done by people who don't live in the area and are oblivious to the dire traffic issues that affect people every day.

May I remind you all that the new link road between Edgar St & Aylestone Hill will have yet more traffic lights at every single junction when in reality all that is needed are roundabouts.

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Well.  I for one am hoping that the garage gets the go-ahead!  99p per litre!?  That's a bargain and no mistake.

In fact, I will go out and buy 2 or 3 massive, gas-guzzling cars, and go out of my way to go to Asda to fill up.  In rotation.  Every day.  During the rush-two-hours.

I'd be stupid not to at those prices!

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Well.  I for one am hoping that the garage gets the go-ahead!  99p per litre!?  That's a bargain and no mistake.

In fact, I will go out and buy 2 or 3 massive, gas-guzzling cars, and go out of my way to go to Asda to fill up.  In rotation.  Every day.  During the rush-two-hours.

I'd be stupid not to at those prices!

 

Competition is good and would keep all the other garages on their toes.

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Mick,/Alex, spend a morning with me in Holme Lacy Road, coffee on me! We will spend some time watching elderly and infirm trying to cross one of the most busy roads, only 10 meters from the Pelican Crossing. Why use a crossing when you can cross the road anywhere? We can watch as mums pushing their offspring in front of them, dodge traffic at the mini round about at junction of Chestnut Drive/ Hoarwithy Road rather than use the crossing provided! You can share my tablets that keep my blood pressure low. We can savour the abuse, lovely ancient English words, as we explain that perhaps walking only a few yards to the pelican crossing can spare their lives, while enjoying the various hand signals drivers have learnt to express themselves!

 

I will then drive you round to St Martins Street, where you can express your view to all ages, young and old, fit and disabled, how, after a clean up of the under pass, new lights, a police officer patrolling,24/7, they can all use the Drybridge Underpass to cross the A49!!!. If we have time, I will introduce you to the St. Martins Street Residents and Traders Association. The residents and businesses in St.Martins Street, spent several hours talking, thinking and helping to design the present road lay out at the time of the ASDAapplication. Perhaps spend a little time at the Drybridge Day Centre. If, after a wonderful day out, you still think that doing away with crossings for pedestrians on the junction at A49/Ross Road/Belmont Road/St. Martin Street/Hinton Road then we can go for a drink at the Welsh Club, where I am sure local members can express themselves far better than I. I will go home then and leave you to it.

 

The price of petrol is not a planning consideration. I will continue to talk to local people, other local councillors, users of Hinton Road, Belmont Avenue and regular users of the main roads for their views on the ASDA application as it is today.

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Mick,/Alex, spend a morning with me in Holme Lacy Road, coffee on me! We will spend some time watching elderly and infirm trying to cross one of the most busy roads, only 10 meters from the Pelican Crossing. Why use a crossing when you can cross the road anywhere? We can watch as mums pushing their offspring in front of them, dodge traffic at the mini round about at junction of Chestnut Drive/ Hoarwithy Road rather than use the crossing provided! You can share my tablets that keep my blood pressure low. We can savour the abuse, lovely ancient English words, as we explain that perhaps walking only a few yards to the pelican crossing can spare their lives, while enjoying the various hand signals drivers have learnt to express themselves!

 

I will then drive you round to St Martins Street, where you can express your view to all ages, young and old, fit and disabled, how, after a clean up of the under pass, new lights, a police officer patrolling,24/7, they can all use the Drybridge Underpass to cross the A49!!!. If we have time, I will introduce you to the St. Martins Street Residents and Traders Association. The residents and businesses in St.Martins Street, spent several hours talking, thinking and helping to design the present road lay out at the time of the ASDAapplication. Perhaps spend a little time at the Drybridge Day Centre. If, after a wonderful day out, you still think that doing away with crossings for pedestrians on the junction at A49/Ross Road/Belmont Road/St. Martin Street/Hinton Road then we can go for a drink at the Welsh Club, where I am sure local members can express themselves far better than I. I will go home then and leave you to it.

 

The price of petrol is not a planning consideration. I will continue to talk to local people, other local councillors, users of Hinton Road, Belmont Avenue and regular users of the main roads for their views on the ASDA application as it is today.

To be fair Chris this happens on most roads around Hereford at peak traffic times.I could take you to Ledbury Road and watch mothers pushing their children across the road missing the crossing by Whittern Way by a mear 20ft.Also  teaching their little ones how to cross the lights at the traffic lights whilst red man is on.Then there is Whittern Way,the rat runners favorite with most exceeding the speed limit in doing so.Same goes for Kingsway or should we call it the Kingsway M5,Sadly I can foresee a fatality on this road in the not to distant future.Yeomas buses,Royal mail,&motorcare amongst others who's managers ignore any complaints about the speed of their vehicles need talking to by the police.

Also needed is the camera safety partnership speed trap vehicle put in places it is really needed not just the money maker roads like Ledbury Road,Three Elms Road etc.

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Coming out of St. Martins Street onto the Asda roundabout at peak times is a VERY long wait and then the road ahead is blocked as there is no yellow box ~ road is clogged by southbound A49 stuff. I nearly got taken out there a few weeks ago trying to exit to go to Asda.

 

I don't subscribe to the campaign for 'all lights out' at all times as I think this needs proper investigation. 

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