Cannot Purchase Hot Food In Hereford City After 1.30am

[Biomech]

THIS IS A PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT
 
Since this thread has now become a "hot topic", there will be no more replies after 1.30am.
You can, however, post freely on any cold thread or topic until such a time as it becomes a hot topic.
 
 
Yours Sincerely
 
Hereford Council
 
PS. Please find attached an invoice for £3,400 for time spent creating this post.

[John Harrington]

Love the Bus Stop Cafe. Looks a bit dodgy from the outside, spartan inside but one of the cleanest place I have eaten in Hereford and the service is lightening! They even do a veggie full monty for when I go through my veggie phases (which is not that often).

[Roger]

I was up at stupid o'clock this morning and went to this establishment to get some breakfast. I knew it would be open as it never closes. It says so on the window. Obviously not in Hereford. 

 

 

I

[Biomech]

Closest 24 hour McDonalds I know of is in Newport on Junction 24(?) Long way to go for a bit of food

[Aylestone Voice]

What I suggest is needed is for one of the take away's to apply to vary its licence. Then you can all write and support it and lobby Glenda and other councillors

Its about as much use as a square wheel you all chuntering to yourselves on this thread.

[Roger]

Closest 24 hour McDonalds I know of is in Newport on Junction 24(?) Long way to go for a bit of food

 

Ranelagh Street ~ Liverpool City Centre. There's about 15 pubs within about 100 yards of it. The Council are realistic and it's open around the clock. No issues at all.

 

What I suggest is needed is for one of the take away's to apply to vary its licence. Then you can all write and support it and lobby Glenda and other councillors

Its about as much use as a square wheel you all chuntering to yourselves on this thread.

 

I don't agree. Public moaning on here, or facebook, or Twitter very often gets a result. I've put pictures of potholes on the web and then strangely they get fixed. Not brilliantly but something gets done.

 

I've also moaned at a certain Educational establishment on Twitter about litter. Next day there was a litter pick arranged for the affected area.

 

Also the moans on here about the Bath Street Offices have generated interest from the Council.

 

If this barmy 130 am food rule is bumped into the public eye often enough then it will come under further scrutiny. 

[Steve Major]

Ranelagh Street ~ Liverpool City Centre. There's about 15 pubs within about 100 yards of it. The Council are realistic and it's open around the clock. No issues at all.

 

 

I don't agree. Public moaning on here, or facebook, or Twitter very often gets a result. I've put pictures of potholes on the web and then strangely they get fixed. Not brilliantly but something gets done.

 

I've also moaned at a certain Educational establishment on Twitter about litter. Next day there was a litter pick arranged for the affected area.

 

Also the moans on here about the Bath Street Offices have generated interest from the Council.

 

If this barmy 130 am food rule is bumped into the public eye often enough then it will come under further scrutiny. 

I tend to agree with you Roger, I have seen several discussions on here turn into actions being implemented, this website and things like social media play a big role these days and should not be ignored.

[Biomech]

Its about as much use as a square wheel you all chuntering to yourselves on this thread. 

 

 

 

We chunter because we know nothing that we do will be listened to. It's the reason half of us don't shop or go out in Hereford anymore. Nothing changes, so we just chunter away :)

[Colin James]

I still go out but not as often and I will keep on about this stupid rule until something is done. Local traders rely on their weekend trade.

 

I have just come back from a trip to Lisbon and although I appreciate it is a huge city, I was amazed to learn that the 'Vasco da Gama Shopping Centre' is open 7 days a week from 9am until midnight! Yes midnight! I was looking in a jewellers on the Saturday and asked the assistant what time they closed to be told midnight, wow I thought, then I asked what about tomorrow being Sunday are you open? to which she replied, we are open until midnight tomorrow too, in fact, 7 days a week and to be fair it was packed with people! On the top floor were plenty of restaurants and fast food joints all bustling with people, everyone that I was with thought it was fantastic.

 

 

Give people choices!

[Aylestone Voice]

I appear to have upset some of you - it was not my intention.

To make progress in Hereford takes time. If you want to really change this then you need to change the policy of the Council and the Police but this takes reviews and goes on forever.

Alternatively another approach I think is to encourage one of the hot food take aways to apply to vary the hours on their licence. This would be publicised and then you will be able to comment making your points that it is unfair etc. Also you can lobby your councillors and those that make the decision. Be aware that (the sainted!) Glenda won't help.

It may succeed.

For example before the take away next to Yates opened their licence came up before the Council Regulatory Committee and both the officers and the police objected (because that is what they do!). It is open now so sometimes sense does prevail. The officers and particularly police cannot see beyond their policy which sees disorder etc from late night opening. Well as I live in the area the fact that the hot food shops are not open late makes little difference. Walking into town now I have to dodge the blood, litter and vomit.

Commenting on here that it is all unfair makes you feel good but it needs more that that to make change happen.

[Biomech]

Give people choices!

 

 

That's the problem isn't it. There is no choice and (see next comment).

 

To make progress in Hereford takes time

 

 

I absolutely agree. But... we don't have progress. We appreciate that the OLM takes time to develop, but now we're nearing completion we find it's packed with shops we already have. So in essence all the OLM has done is shift the city across a bit. Likewise, a river side development takes time, but there is none. The left bank has been left to squander for years, nothing is being done.

 

And that's the problem, I honestly don't think people would complain half as much if we had some transparency and if there was a final benefit or goal. Tell the people of Hereford that their moving the cattle market or Lidl to a new development on the river and you'd get nothing but disdain. Tell the people of Hereford that you're building a Hereford Steak House on the river or some kind of restaurant or relevant  attraction and people would probably praise it.

 

 

I just went into town, the amount of people running red lights was atrocious - but anyway. I was after some catalogue bluray films. ie older than 3 months. Asda and Tesco carry chart titles only, WH Smith only had a couple of straight to TV titles. And it dawned on me, HMV is the ONLY place in Hereford (afaik) that actually sells films and music. And HMV is quite expensive. Not too mention they didn't stock the titles I was after (blockbusters, these weren't obscure titles). I ended up buying most of what I needed from second hand shops.

Had I not needed them for today, I would have ordered from an online company or gone to Worcester/Cardiff because of the choice. And not just products, shops. 

[Biomech]

The 3rd alternative is that we do something ourselves. We open a Hereford Steak House, We open a new music shop. But the rates are extortionate, the council object and cause problems at every turn, it's just not feasible or worth doing.

I'm currently looking at opening up a shop and after considering Hereford first, I'm now looking at Worcester as a more viable option.

[Roger]

I appear to have upset some of you - it was not my intention.

To make progress in Hereford takes time. If you want to really change this then you need to change the policy of the Council and the Police but this takes reviews and goes on forever.

Alternatively another approach I think is to encourage one of the hot food take aways to apply to vary the hours on their licence. This would be publicised and then you will be able to comment making your points that it is unfair etc. Also you can lobby your councillors and those that make the decision. Be aware that (the sainted!) Glenda won't help.

It may succeed.

For example before the take away next to Yates opened their licence came up before the Council Regulatory Committee and both the officers and the police objected (because that is what they do!). It is open now so sometimes sense does prevail. The officers and particularly police cannot see beyond their policy which sees disorder etc from late night opening. Well as I live in the area the fact that the hot food shops are not open late makes little difference. Walking into town now I have to dodge the blood, litter and vomit.

Commenting on here that it is all unfair makes you feel good but it needs more that that to make change happen.

 

 

I think they tried to ban Munchies opening as it was something selling food AGAIN on the The Cumalative Zone. Which is generally town on the Commercial Street/Road side. To include Play Nightclub. Maybe it got a licence as it's just selling food and not booze? Which is really what the current booze rules are for.

 

The Council type people variously discuss this sort of stuff ... 

 

Here's one report I found at random that doesn't even touch on 130am food closures 

 

The food issue seems to have just been thrown into the drawer that can never be opened ... Or maybe it's just a sledgehammer type tool that is being used that does not warrant an agenda item as it cannot be justified? 

[Adrian Pitt]

This ruling has always baffled me. I went to university in Cheltenham in 1999 and food outlets were open until 3am, if not later. Over a decade later and Hereford is totally in the dark ages.

 

It was interesting to note that in Cheltenham aside from KFC the outlets were all independents which concerns me that this is another way Hereford Council is stifling local business.

 

Back in 1999 Hereford supported three major clubs - Play, Eros/Time/Dusk and the Crystal Rooms. Not to mention the smaller late night venues such as Manhattans. Go out on any weekend night at the turn of the century and they were all packed. People traveled from afar such was the fantastic reputation of the Rooms.

 

In 2014 go out and we now only have two large clubs - Play & Fusion. They are rarely packed. Thursdays and Sundays also used to be big 'going out' nights. Now town is deserted on those nights unless it is a bank holiday. Where has everyone gone?

 

The rise of cheap supermarket drinks and the smoking ban account for some lost trade but look to Worcester, Cardiff & Bristol and nightlife is booming regardless. This ridiculous, draconian ban on hot food must surely take a large chunk of blame.

 

Welcome to HV Leon. You have hit the nail on the head! You would be surprised at how many people choose to spend their weekends in Worcester and Gloucester, Cardiff and Bristol, even smaller cities than Hereford you can still get a take away at 3am, Hereford needs to get into the 21st century, its no wonder there are so many empty places here.

[Biomech]

Which is really what the current booze rules are for.

 

 

 

And yet Play nightclub is allowed to sell hot food until closing in the early hours

[Roger]

And yet Play nightclub is allowed to sell hot food until closing in the early hours

 

Play has got a liquor licence until 2 or 3 am. Or something like that. Their primary licence is for the sale of alcohol so the legislation does not require them to have another licence to cover the ancillary act of selling food.

 

Leon has outlined the point again that this draconian cut off is ridiculous. Welcome by the way! 

 

I cannot see the logic of how the late night economies of all the towns/cities mentioned are so different. They aren't. Everywhere else copes but the cops are just like a dog with a bone on this one. I just think the cops are just fixated with this cut off. It must be so that it fits more readily, to their mind, around their shift patterns and lap overs and possibly inadequate late night staffing levels. Don't forget that late at night all the CSO's are off duty and just the bare bones are left. And maybe a few die hard Specials padding out the numbers on no wages.

 

I'm sure they could press a few buttons on the computer and print out a nice map showing all the aggro is in the Cumulative Impact Zone ~ and that we should be grateful to them for allowing anything to open at all ~ but that is where people are slithering around drunk having left the Clubs and boozers. Nil to do with food.

 

Fred Spriggs, the Council Licensing man, is someone I know and I don't think it's any secret that he was previously a Police Sgt in Herefordshire so my perception is that they are all stuck on the same page on this one and are unlikely to shift.

[Jim Kenyon]

Does anyone know what time the food outlets on the "shed" development will be closing because that could have a bearing on the rest of the city!

[dippyhippy]

Funnily enough Jim, I asked the same question a few weeks ago, on the Old Market thread!

There are several food places opening, and if the cinema intends to show late night screenings, folks will be expecting these establishments to be open!

Its only around the corner from Commercial Road, but is it still classed as being in the "No Go" Zone????

[Roger]

 

Its only around the corner from Commercial Road, but is it still classed as being in the "No Go" Zone????

 

The Council has designated the following areas within 

Herefordshire as being subject to a special Cumulative Impact Policy: 

 

The full length of Commercial Road from its junction with Blueschool 

Street to its junction with Aylestone Hill. 

 

100 metres of Blueschool Street, West from its junction with 

Commercial Road.

 

50 metres of Bath Street, East from its junction with Commercial 

Square. 

 

50 metres of Commercial Street, South from its junction with 

Commercial Square. 

 

50 metres of Union Street, South from its junction with Commercial 

Square. 

 

Taken from the Council policy document ~ page 92

 

McDonalds in town had their application to open until 4 AM thrown out in 2012. The premises is just outside the 'No Go' area but imaginative wording by the cops makes it sound like it's right in the middle of it! The argument put forward by the cops was that if they had to provide potential additional cover for it opening late then other parts of the County would possibly suffer.

 

McDonalds late night application refused

[Biomech]

Play has got a liquor licence until 2 or 3 am. Or something like that. Their primary licence is for the sale of alcohol so the legislation does not require them to have another licence to cover the ancillary act of selling food.

 

 

 

I don't care how they've done it, as far as I'm concerned they have a monopoly and it's anti-competitive

[stupidfrustration]

This ruling has always baffled me. I went to university in Cheltenham in 1999 and food outlets were open until 3am, if not later. Over a decade later and Hereford is totally in the dark ages.

 

It was interesting to note that in Cheltenham aside from KFC the outlets were all independents which concerns me that this is another way Hereford Council is stifling local business.

 

Back in 1999 Hereford supported three major clubs - Play, Eros/Time/Dusk and the Crystal Rooms. Not to mention the smaller late night venues such as Manhattans. Go out on any weekend night at the turn of the century and they were all packed. People traveled from afar such was the fantastic reputation of the Rooms.

 

In 2014 go out and we now only have two large clubs - Play & Fusion. They are rarely packed. Thursdays and Sundays also used to be big 'going out' nights. Now town is deserted on those nights unless it is a bank holiday. Where has everyone gone?

 

The rise of cheap supermarket drinks and the smoking ban account for some lost trade but look to Worcester, Cardiff & Bristol and nightlife is booming regardless. This ridiculous, draconian ban on hot food must surely take a large chunk of blame.

 

Leon - what is the population of Worcester / Cardiff / Bristol?

The population of these towns/Cities in comparison to our little village of 59,500 heads?

 

Once we know the answer to that question - please then consider - the Hereford age demographics?

 

How is our 59500 split age wise compared to the above towns/cities?

 

Make it easy for you - perhaps just say Under 30 and over 30?

 

Perhaps that may go some way to explaining why the Nightlife is different to other places.

 

On top of this - employment and of course UNIVERSITY towns/cities compared to our little village. 

 

We will get a university here - but it will be 10 years before we get to the 5000 expected students of the SMT courses on offer here.

 

I do however fully agree with you re the supermarket price drinks. They sell drink to younger people who pre load and then go out to the pubs and clubs and that is what hits the pubs and clubs in town more than anything else.

[stupidfrustration]

I don't care how they've done it, as far as I'm concerned they have a monopoly and it's anti-competitive

 

Biomech

 

Play, Fusion AND Saxtys all have a late night food licence and all serve hot food of some description.

 

You would agree im sure, that when young people have had a drink in a Nightclub in town, its good that these venues can offer food for people to eat inside, in safety, before going home.

 

Of course, a queue outside a kebab shop of which many dont have doorstaff on to keep the queue safe and in control would be much better?

[Colin James]

Biomech

 

Play, Fusion AND Saxtys all have a late night food licence and all serve hot food of some description.

 

You would agree im sure, that when young people have had a drink in a Nightclub in town, its good that these venues can offer food for people to eat inside, in safety, before going home.

 

Of course, a queue outside a kebab shop of which many dont have doorstaff on to keep the queue safe and in control would be much better?

 

I have worked on the doors in Hereford for over 16 years, they used to have door staff at the Golden Galleon and the Palace Chinese before it closed, but they were not really needed, there was hardly any trouble to be honest. This is not doing the local food establishments any good, they rely on their weekend trade!

 

It's a joke! As we have said before it's no wonder people choose to spend their Friday or Saturday nights away from Hereford

[Biomech]

stupidfrustration, that doesn't negate the fact that HC have issued only them with licences and not independent food traders which has created a monopoly. And monopolies are against the law.

 

15 years ago all the shops were open and serving and no one had any trouble or need for bouncers. In fact, it's quite ludicrous that people are arguing that security is needed for a warm ******* sandwich - don't you think?

[stupidfrustration]

stupidfrustration, that doesn't negate the fact that HC have issued only them with licences and not independent food traders which has created a monopoly. And monopolies are against the law.

 

15 years ago all the shops were open and serving and no one had any trouble or need for bouncers. In fact, it's quite ludicrous that people are arguing that security is needed for a warm ******* sandwich - don't you think?

 

 

erm - thanks for asking - but no I dont.

 

My reasoning - My 40 year old next door neighbor - has two kids, a lovely wife and he works hard, as do I.

My neighbor the other side and and his lovely wife in their 30's also work hard, as do i.

 

Neither them, nor I or in fact anyone I know stay at home for the evening, have a few drinks, and then at 0135 think, I know what, Ill leave Bartestree,/Moreton - On - Lugg/ Newton Farm, Bobblestock etc and make our way into town because I really need to get myself a kebab right now.

 

Oh no I cant - as they are all shut as of 5 minutes ago.

 

So - who IS the type of person who wants to have a kebab at 0135.

 

Well, Im a man in my 40's, I like a drink in the Barrels, then onto Watercress and I quite like that new place Shake and Stir - then I go for my kebab at around midnight, as Im done then.

 

So - who IS the type of person who wants to have a kebab at 0135?

 

Im a young lad, Im 20 - Ive had a drink at home, cos its nice and cheep from Tescos, then I went to the Long Bar, and then onto Yates, then I went to Fusion, I danced, drunk some more and then I had a Burger, at the Fusion burger bar at 0230. Its good they had a burger bar, as I had now had 6 drinks during the course of my night.

 

Mmmmmm a Fusion burger, lovely.

 

Who do you think these mysterious customers are at 2am looking for food in Hereford that are not in Saxtys/Play/Fusion?

[stupidfrustration]

I got carried away with my reply - and missed some of your points.

 

15 years ago - there was a need for doorstaff on late night food houses, and in fact today, there is still a need for doorstaff in late night food houses.

 

Firstly - MUNCHIES has doorstaff, as does The Lunch box and in fact in many other towns like, erm, Worcester/Cardiff/Bristol for example all have security on their doors late at night.

 

Perhaps the issue can be resolved by having security as part of the licence for all the late night food places, and let them stay open later.

 

Perhaps 1 security company can take all the doors so all the late night food houses can work together to control this issue.

 

Is it possible that the clubs that have food as part of their licence are helping to reduce disorder in the town centre? 

[stupidfrustration]

I have worked on the doors in Hereford for over 16 years, they used to have door staff at the Golden Galleon and the Palace Chinese before it closed, but they were not really needed, there was hardly any trouble to be honest. This is not doing the local food establishments any good, they rely on their weekend trade!

 

It's a joke! As we have said before it's no wonder people choose to spend their Friday or Saturday nights away from Hereford

 

Hi Colin,

 

I know you are the boss around here, but I have a couple of questions for you?

 

1) Have you asked the police and council re their views about trouble in late night food houses?

And 

2) Which establishments have shut in lets say the last 3 years as they lacked trade after 0135?

 

Not looking to argue - I know you run the site, but I think they are fair questions?

 

[Biomech]

So - who IS the type of person who wants to have a kebab at 0135.

 

 

 

I work late, sometimes I've missed dinner and look for something on the way home. As do many other people who haven't been drinking, security, police, ambulance crews that haven't eaten for 12 hours because of the work load, etc

 

I appreciate your points, but when I used to go out a lot, the fights were outside the clubs not the burger and chip shops. In fact, when we used to go to charcoal grill (because the burgers in the clubs are over priced and taste like crap), the people in the chinese and burger places (customers) were always friendly and had a laugh together. And I'm talking 18-25 not older people.

 

I certainly know that now things are more violent, we avoid places like Play - dubbed fight club because of the ridiculous amounts of fights in there now. You'll actually have a much better time somewhere like the Jailhouse which, granted, doesn't seem like the friendly sort of crowd, but it's full of non judgemental people who are very friendly or pill heads who are just loved up. You're more likely to meet a new friend in there than in fight club.

 

I appreciate what you're saying, but again, we're talking about a warm sandwich being a national security issue :P

[Biomech]

I couldn't name them all, but Flames and good number of others from Union Street, as well as 3-4 in Bridge Street off of the top of my head.

I mean Bridge Street is absolutely dead now, it's like walking down a deserted ally at night there. It used to be bustling with revellers and eateries - now even the street lights struggle to make an appearance.

 

I actually posted not too long ago about walking all over town looking for a good takeaway burger (in the day) and succumbed to eating a tesco prawn sandwich in the car.

[stupidfrustration]

I work late, sometimes I've missed dinner and look for something on the way home. As do many other people who haven't been drinking, security, police, ambulance crews that haven't eaten for 12 hours because of the work load, etc

 

I appreciate your points, but when I used to go out a lot, the fights were outside the clubs not the burger and chip shops. In fact, when we used to go to charcoal grill (because the burgers in the clubs are over priced and taste like crap), the people in the chinese and burger places (customers) were always friendly and had a laugh together. And I'm talking 18-25 not older people.

 

I certainly know that now things are more violent, we avoid places like Play - dubbed fight club because of the ridiculous amounts of fights in there now. You'll actually have a much better time somewhere like the Jailhouse which, granted, doesn't seem like the friendly sort of crowd, but it's full of non judgemental people who are very friendly or pill heads who are just loved up. You're more likely to meet a new friend in there than in fight club.

 

I appreciate what you're saying, but again, we're talking about a warm sandwich being a national security issue :P 

 

 

I think thats the issue here - your info is out of date.

Play / Fusion and Saxtys always have doorstaff out the front doors these days, "fights outside" of clubs are much less than they used to be, again, im pretty confident that the police figures would back that up.

 

Play being fight club - well, you call it what you want, but Play has more people in it on a Saturday night than Mamma Jammers, Saxtys, Fusion and Jail House put together, as such its reasonable to expect more issues in there. But fight club if you wish.

Also "pill heads" - i think you will find that Jail House have done a fair bit to clean up their drugs issues, and less and less drugs are being found there  - and again, im sure police info will back that up.

 

We are not really talking about a warm sandwich being a national security issue, thats a great sound "bite" - we are talking about places where young people, who have had a drink, congregate without security, who then make a mess with food packaging for seagulls to feed on, and re produce that becomes unruly on the streets, thats the issue. 

 

Im very much pro business by the way, but I also understand the other side.